Some people who were sympathetic to Indy were not fans of the SNP leadership and couldn’t separate out the two. Didt accept that an Independent Scotland would have a completely new, broader political landscape and that it wasn’t a recipe for having SNP in power for ever. No party being in power is good for anyone.

There have been significant events recently in Scotland that have impacted Scotland’s politics. On the one hand, the Court’s decision on the lack of power of Scottish institutions to organize a referendum for Independence without the backing of Westminster. On the other hand, a change in the SNP leadership. How has all this affected the pro-independence movement? And support for Independence?

It’s certainly been a roller coaster of a few months and I’m sure that for some people who are perhaps not as fully certain about Independence as some of us, the recent changes may have made them think twice. However there’s nothing about these two items in particular that needs to have any impact on the debate and campaigns going forward.

I don’t think any of us were really surprised that the Supreme Court made the decision it did. At least we know now that legal principle. But there is a vast difference between what is the law and what is JUST. Clearly self determination, being a recognised human right, is a right that cant if there is sufficient demand be taken away from the people of Scotland. The UK government recognises this in principle in the terms of the Good Friday agreement where it is enshrined in that legislation that a referendum of unification can happen and should happen where support is deemed to be in the majority. Therefore that recognition cannot be for one country and not another. The Decision by the Supreme Court does not affect that principle or right it merely closes down one avenue of HOW to achieve it not whether we have the right to achieve it at all.

I think we have become far too mixed up in the process of how and have forgotten the very basic position that Scotland needs to have recognised that at the very least we have the RighT to ask the question at the right time. Even opposition parties in Scotland agree that in principle So to that end the SC decision is disappointing but not the end of the road.

That journey starts with and stays with the people of Scotland who are pushing for seperation. The movement must re-invigorate itself, must get back on the streets round the houses and enter back into the debate.. It must not become distracted by things that are happening in the SNP.. The SNP is not The Indy movement its only a part of , important to be sure but not the whole picture. The Indy movement is made up of people of all parties and none. So the leadership of the SNP is an important matter only in so much as what sort of leadership they will give the movement rather than who it is. Some might say Nicola Sturgeon’s leadership on this issue was lackluster. I wasnt  a fan of using an election as a de facto referendum. What needs to happen is the groundswell of support needed to build till there is an undisputed clamour for Independence. That has nothing to do with who runs the SNP.

Scotland did have a referendum on Independence but did not obtain the necessary support. Looking back, what are the main lessons you would stress from that period? What did not work? What should be done differently next time?

I think we allowed ourselves to have the debate dictated to us. We didn’t have strong enough answers to the currency question. We allowed Westminster to lie about staying in the Eu. We didn’t carry older people, older women and Eu residents with us. That’s now changed. More women than men would now vote for Independence. We Have seen the lie about the EU. Despite voting No AND REMAIN Scotland is out of the EU. Some people who were sympathetic to Indy were not fans of the SNP leadership and couldn’t separate out the two. Didt accept that an Independent Scotland would have a completely new, broader political landscape and that it wasn’t a recipe for having SNP in power for ever. No party being in power is good for anyone.

Seeing this as a struggle that has to be won rather than a constitutional issue that would be nice or change. It has to be human rights based and it has to be about natural justice and democracy. We go back to basics and get people to accept the principle that we have a right to ask the question

Westminster has no appetite to authorize a new referendum in Scotland. So how can pro-independence maintain the momentum on this issue without the risk of going down?

It’s about building momentum. Seeing this as a struggle that has to be won rather than a constitutional issue that would be nice or change. It has to be human rights based and it has to be about natural justice and democracy. We  go back to basics and get people to accept the principle that we have a right to ask the question. At some point the push for that to happen as soon as we can consistently show a large margin of support. That’s not now 50-52% for YES it’s  a big enough margin

You represent a movement called Women for Independence. What was the relevance of women’s votes in the referendum? Did the pro-independence movement answer correctly to the Scottish women’s needs, fears, and questions at that time? How important do you consider this for the future?

Wokne didn’t support Indy to the same extent as men in the first referendum. The survey shows now however that more women than men would vote YES.. That might have been the Nicol Effect. Women felt there was too much time spent on the whens and hows not the whys and what about Indy. Not enough about what Scotland would look like They wanted answers to different questions than male campaigners leaders and commentators were asking. That’s why WFI was born to redress that balance. I say we have. We are called Women for Independence-Independence for Women so we are constantly campaigning about women’s issues under the current constitutional arrangement now. We know that the life of woman and girls in Scotland will only have their full potential realised when we control all the powers to drive a stronger economy, alleviate child poverty; have  an human right based health and social care system and recognise women in ALL the role they play whether working or at home as carers and child rearers.

Its a big job but we are ready for it.

The TM eLab is an initiative of the Olaso Dorrea Foundation, which offers its heritage to the Basque pro-sovereignity movement.